Will the Cavs make the playoffs?

[Joro]

Originally Posted by Ignorant

Exactly... I forgot to mention that.

One big reason why Kobe will NEVER be better than or just as great as Jordan is the fact that Kobe has lost TWO finals, not one, but TWO... and he got OWNED by Pierce in the last one he lost.

That is inconceivable happening to Jordan in his prime... completely unfathomable.

LOL .... Jordan lost in the first round, second round, and Conference Finals MANY TIMES. I.E.... many years he wasn't even good enough to MAKE IT TO THE FINALS.

Kobe is only 30 years old. When Jordan was 30 years old HE HAD ONLY BEEN TO TWO FINALS. Kobe has already been to SIX, and won FOUR.

[Mark Eaton]

Originally Posted by IcE MiX

All bullshit aside, kobe instills the same fear in his competition and the same need to build the team defense to stop him as jordan did in his day ..that CANNOT be argued.

so does lebron

used to think one day carmello would have, but it wont happen

wade's got the same thing goin on

[Joro]

Originally Posted by Ignorant

Blocks are about as overrated a defensive statistic as sacks are for a DE or a LB.

Wade also let a lot of people blow past him.

And tell me, why didn't Kobe guard Pierce in the '08 Finals?

And when did Kobe ever score 100 points in a game?

So by your logic, Wilt is better than Kobe.

No...by my logic, Wilt is a better SCORER than Kobe. Jordan too. But we're comparing Jordan and Kobe, aren't we.

Ask Phil Jackson why Kobe didn't guard Pierce.

I don't see how blocks are overrated. You're taking away points from the opponents. And if a teamate recovers the looseball, you're creating a possesion for your team. And for Wade to accomplish this feat as a perimeter player is outstanding.

If you can't agree it's outstanding, at least you have to agree it's nothing Jordan ever accomplished as a defender.

[Mark Eaton]

Originally Posted by Ignorant

Blocks are about as overrated a defensive statistic as sacks are for a DE or a LB.
.

iggy, my man dont ever say that

any tackle for a loss of yards and down is a great play... plus pressure alone can cause fumbles and interceptions

[Fatal is back]

Kobe is a better 3pt shooter than mj id agree wit that. I love bron cuz he from my city but dude along wit kobe and wade not on mj's level.

Kobe thought it was cute to not shoot in game 7 vs phoenix...

When I seen Jordan I knew they was gone win and they did. You saw kobe wit shaq and shit and you'd say they gone win and they didn't.

Do u know how many hall of famers/great players are ringless cuz jordan?

Barkley
Malone
Stockton
Reggie miller
Gary payton (I ain't counting that miami ring cuz he chased shaq around)
Shawn Kemp
And the list is much longer than this but its 3am and I gotta sleep maneeeee

Oh yea imo Duncan is the greatest since mj retired. Out
Posted via Mobile Device

[toker]

Originally Posted by IcE MiX

your a fucking idiot^ FIRST OFF KOBE WON game 2 of the finals that year ..fat ass shaq came into that season OVERWEIGHT ..Kobe's offseason regime.. NO ONE CAN DISPUTE he works harder than ANYONE in the league to be the best at what he does.. SECONDLY, you ask ANY knowledgeable basketball mind who watched both kobe and jordan, they'll tell you KOBE IS A MORE DYNAMIC SCORER then Jordan is HANDS DOWN ..And if you want to start with one reason why? Better Pure Shooter: Kobe vs. Jordan. | 247SportsTalk.com

Kobe is a better pure shooter. If there were hate blogs and the internet as prevalent today as it was then, you'd realize Jordan was a huge asshole..talented YES...asshole absolutely..So to besmirch kobe because of what people percieve as a pompous attitude is fucking stupid if your trying to make the comparison to MJ. And if you say Jordan wouldn't of lost in the finals in his prime..you can make the argument considering kobe just turned 30...HE IS STILL IN HIS PRIME. And even with everyone on the olympic team from Lebron to Melo to Wade..guess who there go to guy was in the clutch situations as well as there BEST on ball defender (with respect to D WADE who has improved RIDICULOUSLY) yes thats right.. KOBE. Stop hating on the guy. Jordan and Kobe are in TWO different eras of basketball... People always get butt hurt when the student starts to meet the level of the master..its like oh shit this isn't right... YEAH Jordan is probably the greatest player to ever live...but Kobe's still got a lot left in his tank..so let the jury stay out until its all said and done.

Hell some people even claim that magic johnson is the best basketball player of all time, and add on in support that not only because of his skill set but because he could play any and every position. Kobe is all defensive first time year in and year out Do you people not even acknowledge that? Jordan needed the cast of players he had, and Kobe finally had a strong enough cast last year to get a championship without Shaq. The same fucking idiots who say Jordan could have won without pippen, say that lebron would have won the championship if he had a better supporting cast...and while both hate on kobe DOn't even see the stupid fucking double standard thats been set up.

And you can easily make the argument that SHAQ IMPACTED THE NBA MORE THAN JORDAN Look at how the rules changed....does that make shaq then the best player of all time? fuckin seriously people..

All bullshit aside, kobe instills the same fear in his competition and the same need to build the team defense to stop him as jordan did in his day ..that CANNOT be argued.

u laker faggots crack me up

i know more bout your team than any u scrubs


that great kobe u talkin bout sucked ass vs the pistons..

notice how he didnt mention kobe shootin 38% vs the pistons..

kobe = robin

and a shitty one at that.. nigga a horrible teammate


oh yea 38%.. thats fuckin horrible.. i didnt crunch shaqs numbers but i bet he shoot over 50% that series..

like i said.. kobe no showed

[toker]

Originally Posted by Joro

Rode Shaq to 3 rings?

Those Championship Lakers would look to Kobe to defend the opposing team's best scorer.

And when the game was on the line with 4 seconds left, would the Lakers go to Shaq or Kobe?

Case closed.

toker

yea thats why kobe won finals mvp during the 3 peat


oh wait.....

they should change your name from joro to joto

bitch

[toker]

bitch ass laker fans

heres the truth bout that homo on your team

these fags always try to down play kobe riding shaq to them titles even though they know its the turth


here lets check the game

their first title vs the pacers.. kobe is basically a non factor

he shot 37% that series..... ballllllinnnnnn lol

[toker]

how bout ve them pacers???

he did better but not as good as shaq..


he shot ~42% from the field.. shaq was welll over 50%...


another unimpressive series


can u say over rated?????

[toker]

the nets series is the only one that he did good in.. 1/4 aint a good ratio no matter how u cut it

but back to the nets series

kobe shot an impressive 51%.. but once again shaq dominated.. his worst game he shot 55% from the field


so in 4 title runs with shaq, kobe posted 51%, 42, 37, and 38..


like i said kobe got carried to his titles.. any decent wingman coulda won with shaq

[Joro]

toker...you answered none of my questions. Who was the Lakers' top defender? Who did the Lakers go to in the clutch?

The obvious answer to both questions is "their best player"... especially if that player is the same dude on both counts. Best defender/go-to-guy in the clutch = Kobe

You think MVP awards say it all? A title-run isn't accomplished in one series. For example, you may remember during the Laker's second title, in 2001, they faced the Spurs in the WCF. It was hyped as a "Showdown of The Past Two Champions", as the Lakers had won the previous year, and the Spurs the year before that. The Spurs were the #1 seed for this playoffs, and the favorites.

Kobe DOMINATED that series. Getting to the hole shockingly easily and scoring at will...the Lakers took this much hyped-up showdown...IN FOUR. What was supposed to go seven, with the Spurs picked by most people to take it, turned into a joke of a series. AND IT WAS BECAUSE OF KOBE. You may remember, this was the series when Shaq said during a post-game press conference, and I quote, "KOBE BRYANT IS THE BEST PLAYER IN THE LEAGUE - BY FAR" .........

That was Shaq's opinion.

(if you chose to reply in the face of these facts please take the time to address each of them)

[Fatal is back]

I remember these arguments when I was in high school. They complimented each other well but Shaq was better.

How'd the lakers get Bynum? Jordans team never picked in the fuckin lottery gtfoh
Posted via Mobile Device

[Ignorant]

Originally Posted by Joro

LOL .... Jordan lost in the first round, second round, and Conference Finals MANY TIMES. I.E.... many years he wasn't even good enough to MAKE IT TO THE FINALS.

He didn't have the help all those years, but nevertheless, when he got to the Finals, he didn't lose. I didn't bring up all the times Kobe never made the playoffs. Because that's not the point. Jordan paid his dues longer than Kobe did, because he had help early.

Kobe is only 30 years old. When Jordan was 30 years old HE HAD ONLY BEEN TO TWO FINALS. Kobe has already been to SIX, and won FOUR.

Here we go with the weak age argument... Kobe was 18 when he entered the league... Jordan was 21. And again, Kobe went to an already built team with the Lakers when he was young. Jordan built the Bulls from the ground up. So really, you just hurt yourself in your own argument. Jordan is better because he helped to build a team. Kobe was GIVEN a great situation early.

You could win a few rings riding the bench on that Laker squad... would that make you better than Jordan? C'mon man.

[Ignorant]

Originally Posted by Joro

Ask Phil Jackson why Kobe didn't guard Pierce.

It's one of the reasons why Phil isn't a great coach. The ring fallacy dominates that argument, too, and it shouldn't. Phil Jackson is one of the weakest coaches ever. I would say Larry Brown is better. Pat Riley is better.

I don't see how blocks are overrated. You're taking away points from the opponents. And if a teamate recovers the looseball, you're creating a possesion for your team. And for Wade to accomplish this feat as a perimeter player is outstanding.

Blocks are cheap. Most can get them with physical height or jumping ability alone. It's misleading to use blocks as a major aspect of great D, because there is still the possiblity of the other team recovering and scoring anyway. Shut the most dominant player down first. Don't let him get a shot off. That's great D. Jordan was a good blocker, too, btw.

[Ignorant]

Originally Posted by Mark Eaton

iggy, my man dont ever say that

any tackle for a loss of yards and down is a great play... plus pressure alone can cause fumbles and interceptions

No, I like sacks, but I think it gets overused when measuring a D-line player's ability... like they never mention regular tackles or tackles for loss or QB pressures or pass breakups. It's like if a D-line player has a low sack year, he sucks. When that's crazy. I don't see them giving the same pressures to DB's with interceptions. You can still be a shutdown corner and have few INT's, because if you're locking down, the QB won't throw in your direction as much.

[toker]

kobe shot 42% from the field his 4 trips with shaq






weakkkkkkkkkk asssssss fuckkkkkkkkkkkk

glen rice>>> kobe
robert horry>>> kobe
fisher >>> kobe

[Joro]

So help me get this straight fellas...

All the years Kobe played on a bad team, it was because Kobe sucked.

All the years Jordan played on a bad team, it was because Jordan didn't have help.

All the years Kobe won Championships, it was because he played on a great team.

All the years Jordan won Championships, it was because Jordan himself was a great player.



So what you're telling me is Jordan gets all the credit for winning, and no blame for losing. While Kobe gets no credit for winning, and all the blame for losing.

Have I understood your argument correctly?

[IcE MiX]

Originally Posted by toker

u laker faggots crack me up

i know more bout your team than any u scrubs


that great kobe u talkin bout sucked ass vs the pistons..

notice how he didnt mention kobe shootin 38% vs the pistons..

kobe = robin

and a shitty one at that.. nigga a horrible teammate


oh yea 38%.. thats fuckin horrible.. i didnt crunch shaqs numbers but i bet he shoot over 50% that series..

like i said.. kobe no showed

Hey MORON, tell me how Shaq faired VS Hakeem in the finals? oh thats right they got DOMINATED. SHAQ WAS young, and Kobe has only recently hit his prime. He had Penny, and couldn't get it done.. I PROMISE You, Shaq without Kobe would not have won the titles they did in L.A. Jordan had Pippen, and Kobe simply had a bad series..your dumb ass still didn't defend any of the points I made in the first post. And Joro is the only person with some LOGIC IN this posting ..Kobe gets hated on the SAME DOUBLE STANDARD that Lebron gets slack for...fuckin stupid.


KOBE averaged in last years finals 43% field goal, 7.4 assists, 1.4 steals,1.4 blocks and 5 rebounds ..oh and 36% from 3, which by the way.. KOBE HAS A HIGHER CAREER REG SEASON AND PLAYOFF AVERAGE FROM 3.. Michael Jordan Past Stats, Playoff Stats, Statistics, History, and Awards

Go look at Jordans early numbers in the league and then go look when he hit thirty..You'll see the proof is in the pudding. YES Jordan as of now was the greatest ever at his position, because people can argue that Shaq, Wilt, and others had just as much impact...but this doesn't mean kobe won't be in the conversation when its all said and done.

[IcE MiX]

oh and toker ..you idiot. like Joro said...in the clutch situation...Would hack a shaq with his piece of shit FT percentage get the ball..or Kobe with his 85 percent plus FT percentage ..who cooly would knock down the FT's to win the game.. yeah thats right KOBE..but OH Shaq did everything kobe was a shitty sidekick.... And by your STAT logic.. allen iverson is trash considering he shot in 01 finals 40 percent and 28 percent from three and considering how many times he shoots the ball ..and his percentage..he's horrible right? get the fuck outta here ...if iverson won that finals ..people wouldn't give a shit about his stats..the fact he won and he was the leader of the team was enough.

quit dwelling on stats or rings..and utilize both in evaluating a player.. fucking people stick to one without seeing the other side. Magic Johnson had 5 rings.. and Lost in one finals to MJ yet people still consider him in the conversation of best player ever

[toker]

Originally Posted by IcE MiX

Hey MORON, tell me how Shaq faired VS Hakeem in the finals? oh thats right they got DOMINATED. SHAQ WAS young, and Kobe has only recently hit his prime. He had Penny, and couldn't get it done.. I PROMISE You, Shaq without Kobe would not have won the titles they did in L.A. Jordan had Pippen, and Kobe simply had a bad series..your dumb ass still didn't defend any of the points I made in the first post. And Joro is the only person with some LOGIC IN this posting ..Kobe gets hated on the SAME DOUBLE STANDARD that Lebron gets slack for...fuckin stupid.

shaq shot 59% from the field vs the rockets .. so its not like he wasnt doing his part on offense

and it took kobe 10+ years to hit his prime?? plz

oh an kobe didnt have 1 bad series... he had 3 of them

dunno why u bring up lebron.. im not a fan of guards/wingmen

and if u bring up pippen why dont u mention bynum??? bynum was a lottery pick too..