Morality Does Not Exist!

[Cryptick]

Take God out the picture, take religion out the picture.

Are all humans built with a sense of morality?

Can this even be proven? what evidentairy support could one provide, and will we ever have a definitive answer?

or is morality just the mind's creation?

[.:Pain:.]

Any action done out of fear of consequence has no moral value to it.

The fact of the matter is, until you do some evil shit and examine how you feel afterwards, you will never know if you truly are a moral person...

[Cryptick]

You see I don't buy that type of reasoning.

Cause moral values are taught as early as infancy. So if I was told my whole life that you will feel bad if you kill someone, the psycological framework that has been implented into my brain since my adolesence, I will probably feel bad.

But that doesn't explain if it exists or not. All that tells me is a nigga told me it exists.

[Joro]

"If there is no God, what is left that we cannot do? All is permissible!" - Ivan Karamazov

"God is dead" - Freidrich Nietzche



Ivan Karamazov was a character in a work of fiction by Theodor Dostoevsky. Nietzche, however, was a real person who lived and wrote for this topic. Nietzche ended up going crazy, talking to horses n shit, and dying in a mental hospital.

So you can argue that there is no Creator, and thus no meaning, if you want to. Just be aware of the dangers to your own mind.

Or you can do you....watch some snuff porn...go out and kill a kitten....then go home and feel good about life.

[.:Pain:.]

You see I don't buy that type of reasoning.

Cause moral values are taught as early as infancy. So if I was told my whole life that you will feel bad if you kill someone, the psycological framework that has been implented into my brain since my adolesence, I will probably feel bad.

But that doesn't explain if it exists or not. All that tells me is a nigga told me it exists.

Infants have been shown to a conscience, before their understanding of english comes into play.

Or you can do you....watch some snuff porn...go out and kill a kitten....then go home and feel good about life.

That's what I do...

[Cryptick]

Originally Posted by Joro

"If there is no God, what is left that we cannot do? All is permissible!" - Ivan Karamazov

"God is dead" - Freidrich Nietzche



Ivan Karamazov was a character in a work of fiction by Theodor Dostoevsky. Nietzche, however, was a real person who lived and wrote for this topic. Nietzche ended up going crazy, talking to horses n shit, and dying in a mental hospital.

So you can argue that there is no Creator, and thus no meaning, if you want to. Just be aware of the dangers to your own mind.

Or you can do you....watch some snuff porn...go out and kill a kitten....then go home and feel good about life.

This doesn't contribute to the thread at all.

One thing this board does contribute however are inspiring comedians.. RM must be an outlet to express their humor.

Freud, like nietzsche, also supposed that we humans have difficulty seeing ourselves for what we truely are becaues of a powerful tendency to picture ourselves in the most flattering way possible. - This is true, and i think most would agree.

Fact is, we are just advanced animals. And all im saying is, if this is true... where does morality come into play? or is that just a creation of the mind?

Infants have been shown to a conscience, before their understanding of english comes into play.

what evedentiary support do you have to back up this claim?

[.:Pain:.]

^It's in my developmental psyche textbook, I'll google to see if there's study on the net...

[.:Pain:.]

Can't find it and I don't feel like combing EBSCO, but here's the gist.

Since baby's can reason (they make different cries to show that they want different things, a hunger cry is different from a pain cry), and reasoning the basis for conscience, from a cognitive perspective, then babies can indeed reason what is good and what is bad...

[newflute]

I know it sounds CRAZY.

Depending upon what scale you're using, the concepts change anyhow.
I'm feelin what you wrote about the "Baby."

A child was born with no state of mind.
Blind to the ways of mankind. (Sugar Hill )
However.............after puberty..........
There are people who enjoy what you call pain and vise versa, but yo dis is a hip hop forum and traditionally I aint supposed to think. LOL

Duh yo yo yo etc.
What it do?
I thought you knew
If I mess up dis flo.
You gonna say I blew.
Coupe de tat
I keeps it true
Peace yo
Im threw.

[newflute]

Originally Posted by Cryptick

This doesn't contribute to the thread at all.

One thing this board does contribute however are inspiring comedians.. RM must be an outlet to express their humor.

Freud, like nietzsche, also supposed that we humans have difficulty seeing ourselves for what we truely are becaues of a powerful tendency to picture ourselves in the most flattering way possible. - This is true, and i think most would agree.

Fact is, we are just advanced animals. And all im saying is, if this is true... where does morality come into play? or is that just a creation of the mind?



what evedentiary support do you have to back up this claim?

Beloved Cryptick,
From the days of Adam and on, the art world has had straight forward square thinking opposing new thought. Hip Hop is expanding. The emergence of Romantisim, Jazz, Rock and Roll , Hip Hop have allways had critics that get lost in formal tradition. This takes away from progressive thinking. Yes the truth is comical, but where are you?

[Joro]

Originally Posted by Cryptick

One thing this board does contribute however are inspiring comedians..

I'm glad I inspire you ....

[Joro]

Also, my original post had everything to do with this thread. Read it again, very slowly.

[Memento]

Originally Posted by Cryptick

Take God out the picture, take religion out the picture.

Are all humans built with a sense of morality?

Can this even be proven? what evidentairy support could one provide, and will we ever have a definitive answer?

or is morality just the mind's creation?

Originally Posted by Cryptick

You see I don't buy that type of reasoning.

Cause moral values are taught as early as infancy. So if I was told my whole life that you will feel bad if you kill someone, the psycological framework that has been implented into my brain since my adolesence, I will probably feel bad.

But that doesn't explain if it exists or not. All that tells me is a nigga told me it exists.

[Riz]

Neither of those vidoes refute postmodernism. That's probably mostly to do with the fact that he's either misrepresenting or misundersating it.

Start here:

http://www.swarthmore.edu/Documents/...onal-being.pdf

[Tequila Jong-il]

If one were to make the claim that HE is MISUNDERSTANDING postmodernism I would think they'd be better served by not linking to a paper that, amongst other things, argues that thinking in terms of units is detrimental(no 'he' for him) and that meaning is the product of reciprocal engagement(meaning cannot be misunderstood, it can only fail to be produced)

The author might have expressed your sentiment this way "a conflict in discursive traditions has lead to the failure to create meaning"

In fact, taking the paper seriously, instead of writing the above I could have replied in disagreement

"mnah wagooooo !! z%$ 000000000"

and we would have had to made it a score draw, each of us being equally at fault for not resolving the dispute.

So, yeah, the paper didn't rebut the big picture criticisms levied in the video for me. I interpreted it as merely a very long act of rhetorical slipperiness where the author advocated that certain foundational assumptions be subsumed by a relativist approach simply because the he felt that would benefit his own set of foundational assumptions. In fact my favourite part of the paper was when he basically admitted this was what he was doing but cautioned that it would only make sense to criticise the argument on this point if we make the mistake of thinking in units. He's in effect saying "yes my whole argument is inherently contradictory and I am huge hypocrite but if we assume I don't exist then I obviously cannot be offering an inherently contradictory argument or be a huge hypocrite. Aha!"

[Riz]

Originally Posted by Tequila Jong-il

If one were to make the claim that HE is MISUNDERSTANDING postmodernism I would think they'd be better served by not linking to a paper that, amongst other things, argues that thinking in terms of units is detrimental(no 'he' for him) and that meaning is the product of reciprocal engagement(meaning cannot be misunderstood, it can only fail to be produced)

Only if you assume that I'm a postmodernist and/or that my phrasing has any relevance to his argument and/or that a postmodernist wouldn't use the words "he" and "misunderstanding".

The author might have expressed your sentiment this way "a conflict in discursive traditions has lead to the failure to create meaning"

In fact, taking the paper seriously, instead of writing the above I could have replied in disagreement

"mnah wagooooo !! z%$ 000000000"

and we would have had to made it a score draw, each of us being equally at fault for not resolving the dispute.

YOU are still MISUNDERSTANDING.

So, yeah, the paper didn't rebut the big picture criticisms levied in the video for me.

I know words have no inherent meaning, but when I said "start here" I understood it to mean that this is just somewhere to begin.

Having said that, that article does highlight the overarching "big picture" that consistently comes up in relativistic schools of thought: human/individual choice. That may not be a big enough big picture for you, but it's still there...

[Riz]

Teq, did you ever see that BBC documentary The Power of Nightmares from a few years ago?