hard limiting effect?

Odd · 10-15-2009, 12:42 AM

is it true that hard limiting is a way to get full volume out of your final mixdown without peaking the track? It seems to work differently depending on the track.....any insight.

Mr. ROUSH · 10-15-2009, 02:24 PM

Hard limiting is a crucial part of getting max loudness from a track... to understand hard limiting is to understand compression.. any compressor being used with a ratio 10:1 or greater becomes a limiter.. Hard limiting means that the transients are completely cut off above the threshold.. so you can put a limiter on your master and set the threshold at -.03 - -.05db which is approx. the industry standard these days.. That will get the track as close to zero as possible without clipping...

HOWEVER!!!

Limiting is not the ONLY filter/effect that belongs in a mastering chain.. Prior to a limiter you're almost always going to have at least a multiband compressor and eq in order to give the song the tonal balance necessary to be able to limit it correctly.. if the song isn't mixed correctly and if the individual tracks aren't compressed and eq'd properly than putting a limiter on the master will just make it sound worse... loud and noisy.. so just understand that each stage of mixing or mastering is dependant on each other stage in the mix being correct..

A big tip here is to use two limiters instead of just 1.. dial down each one by half of the usual setting of one.. so that together they equal the overall goal.. this will improve the quality of the limiting and prevent any one limiter from working too hard and becoming less effective..

Hope that helps.. as always if you have other questions.. roushy1@gmail.com

Odd · 10-15-2009, 09:09 PM

Well, i got the presonus eureka channel strip (ratio knob goes from 1 - 10, I have it set at 6 and the threshold goes from -40 - +20 and I have that set at -18)....so my vocals are already compressed before the signals gets inputted to the program. Then I eq each individual vocal track so that it sit's into the beat just right. After that I mix all the tracks down into a single wav. Then I hit it with the hard limit. Sometimes the hard limit has my shit sounding hella professional and good, sometimes it makes the overall song sound terrible and it makes the high hats sounds like freddie krueger scratching a chalk board.

Let me get this right (I'm using adobe audition by the way). Basically what you saying is, after the mixdown I hit it with a hard limter (limit to -.1db). If it sound crappy, then I hit it with another hard limter (limit to -.1db)

Mr. ROUSH · 10-19-2009, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Odd

Well, i got the presonus eureka channel strip (ratio knob goes from 1 - 10, I have it set at 6 and the threshold goes from -40 - +20 and I have that set at -18)....so my vocals are already compressed before the signals gets inputted to the program. Then I eq each individual vocal track so that it sit's into the beat just right. After that I mix all the tracks down into a single wav. Then I hit it with the hard limit. Sometimes the hard limit has my shit sounding hella professional and good, sometimes it makes the overall song sound terrible and it makes the high hats sounds like freddie krueger scratching a chalk board.

Let me get this right (I'm using adobe audition by the way). Basically what you saying is, after the mixdown I hit it with a hard limter (limit to -.1db). If it sound crappy, then I hit it with another hard limter (limit to -.1db)

No that's not exactly what I'm getting at.. if after you mixdown and hit it with the limiter..(either just 1 or 2) and if at that point it doesn't sound right.. then you need to go back and find the problem in the mix.. This could be anything of course but the high end is a common problem area if you find you're having trouble in the mastering statge..

what I meant by using two limiters is this.. let's say that you normally limit the track to -.1db using one limiter.. well.. set two limiters at -.5db to reach -.1db overall.. make sense? This allows the limiters to share the load that way neither one of them are working two hard.. but rather working quickly and effectively together to get a better end result..

Make sure you aren't automatically using the same settings to hard limit every time.. every mix is unique. Some tracks will need more or less limiting.. so be sure you're adjusting the threshold accordingly and not using the exact same levels.. if you just can't get the sound you want no matter what you try in the mastering chain.. then dial back your levels a little bit and check your eq's for problem frequencies.. dial back your compressors a bit too.. overcompression will put an end to effective mastering.. Hope that cleared it up a little. pz.

Mr. ROUSH · 10-19-2009, 03:45 PM

I should add to this that if you are not making the beats from scratch yourself, then you may not want to use a limiter all the time.. If you are using pre-made beats then you won't be able to make adjustments to individual instruments.. Amature producers generally master the beats and don't leave headroom to master later once the vocals are added so that the beat will sound better to the client... therefor you can't master it any further, you can only mix the vocals to it as best as possible. Good producers should give you the master session file with the insturments / sounds tracked out and unmastered so you can make the most of it.