boris diaw

double ML · 03-05-2006, 05:27 PM

this cat is sick with it

playin' every spot but PG

just dropped a triple double on the mavs

most improved player for sure

Final Chapta · 03-05-2006, 05:31 PM

i agree. dude was sick with it today..

Cigma · 03-05-2006, 06:37 PM

Tony Parker for most improved!

Diaw is nice though, but you can attribute his success from a combination of more playing time and playing in a different system, instead of buried deep in the bench in a half court orientated offense.

Brahman · 03-05-2006, 07:02 PM

how is tony parker deserving of most improved?

his scoring has boosted a little with a better fg%, but his rebounds are the same and his ast/to ratio has worsened

double ML · 03-05-2006, 07:03 PM

tony parker is french. he doesn't count.

**ignores the fact that diaw is also french**

Old Soul · 03-05-2006, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by double ML

tony parker is french. he doesn't count.

**ignores the fact that diaw is also french**

Hahahha

Cigma · 03-05-2006, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brahman

how is tony parker deserving of most improved?

his scoring has boosted a little with a better fg%, but his rebounds are the same and his ast/to ratio has worsened

You can't measure everything in just stats. (you know this man)

Parker runs the Spurs offense. When he is penetrating, dishing, using his speed, and hitting his outside shots, the Spurs are near invincible. He puts a lot of pressure on opposing defenses, making them collapse in the paint, opening things up for other people.

His decision making is vastly improved as well as the way he implements his game. Also Parker is running the Spurs offense with Duncan having his worst ppg average since 1997. He's carrying the offensive load, averaging near 20 ppg, the most on the Spurs, plus he's behind only Shaq in fg %. For a guard to do that is amazing.

Parker has similar tools as he did last year, but he's also developed his outside shot and it is consistent now, whereas in seasons past it fluctuated like the tides.

With that to complement his other skills, he now more than ever is able to get in the paint at will, with a feint, then lightning to the bucket and a layup or teardrop.

It's really has a lot to do with the way his game has matured. He knows what he can do on the floor and does it. He's more confident and strong in his movements.

Last year he was very good on the cusp of great, this year he is an all-star.

He made the leap, and now he's elite.

Brahman · 03-05-2006, 11:15 PM

tim duncan's still playing very good basketball, and i don't see how tony parker's intangible improvements have benefitted the spurs more than boris diaw's tangible improvements have benefitted both him and the suns... decision-making has to be backed by something numerical, and a worse AST/TO ratio is not exactly indicative of "better decision-making"

the suns are missing amare stoudemire, and in comes this kid who's not used to being one of a team's important pieces and flourishes while keeping the team above pre-season expectations

boris diaw > tony parker in terms of consideration for MIP

easily

Cigma · 03-05-2006, 11:46 PM

But look - you keep pointing out things like 'a worse asst/to' ratio and that's suppose to mean that he hasn't got better?

Watch the games, by your logic Parker has regressed. He's easily better than last year. Coincidence how the coaches selected him to be an All-Star?

Also Tim Duncan is not right. He's not scoring, and that is tangibly affecting Parkers asst/to ratio. Ginobili has been injuried this year too. That tangibly affects Parkers asst/to ratio.

You can't just look at the stat sheet and correlate it to something, they stats can be misleading.

As far as Diaw is concerned, the change in scenery and increased playing time accounts for his increased stats, just as much as any 'improvement' in his game that has manifested.

How about the tangibles of having Steve Nash, Marion and company, plus the Suns up and down system.

On his former team, Diaw was mired on the bench and out of favor. They wanted him to be more of a scorer, and he is a very unselfish, pass first player.

On the Suns his passing first mentality fits with what they do. I can't really say that Diaw improved that much - rather that he has freed to be the type of player he's more comfortable being. How can you guage his improvement, when he didn't get minutes last year?

Anyway, the leap from not playing to being a good player in a role that's more suited for you - does not in my mind outweigh the leap from very good to elite. Not everyone can make that jump, into the top echelon.

Parker has developed more of a mastery on his game, and Diaw is just now able to play his.

Brahman · 03-05-2006, 11:56 PM

yeah, i'm looking...

for practical purposes, though, it makes no sense to scrutinize players' games that closely, because you'd be in an endless search of picking apart variables and will end up overlooking somebody. if we analyzed all players the way you're analyzing parker, i'm sure we'd come up with somebody who's improved more than he has.

i don't think the league has ever given out the MIP award on the basis you're calling for in defense of tony parker... it almost always goes to the player who's seen the biggest tangible jumps in their outputs for whatever reason, be it more playing time, a new system, etc.

boris diaw is not only getting better stats because of higher minutes... he's become a lot more efficient with his shooting and passing as well.

Cigma · 03-06-2006, 12:00 AM

Read my editted post.

Tim Duncan is having an off year, Ginobili is having an off year. That affects Parker's asst/to ratio. Those two scorers are the normal beneficiaries of Parkers assits, and they aren't scoring.

That's your only flaw with his game? Lol.. you point out Diaw has become more efficient with his shooting and passing.. but Parker is shooting the second best fg % in the league besides Shaq!

Nash is having almost a better year than last year, Marion is having a better year than last year. Diaw was with the Hawks last year... hrm. Correlation?

How can you say Diaw has become more efficient shooting and passing, when you didn't get to see him do that last year?

There is no benchmark for Diaw. Parker we can see made the leap from great to elite.

Old Soul · 03-06-2006, 01:19 AM

They're not gonna give it to someone like Parker because he already put up good statlines.

Cigma · 03-06-2006, 01:47 AM

When I said "Tony Parker for most improved!" - I was being facetious.

His stats haven't increased dramatically, but his game, in terms of what he does on the court and the manner in which he performs, has defintley elevated to new heights.

Diaw will more than likely receive the nod and he is very deserving. It was not my intent to downplay Diaw.

03-05-2006, 05:27 PM	#1 (permalink)
double ML is evolution. Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: at the crib laughin' my ass off at the lakers' chokejob Posts: 52,742	boris diaw this cat is sick with it playin' every spot but PG just dropped a triple double on the mavs most improved player for sure __________________ dope quote of the moment: "Nigga you look like the gay hairdresser from Zohan, fuck up."- DRUG.(shittin' on pyro tecknik's existence) idiot quote of the moment: "at least 20/10 on a regular.. niggaz a beast"- jnyce(talkin' about kwame brown, and clearly showin' he doesn't know a goddamn thing about the NBA) Last edited by double ML; 03-05-2006 at 05:28 PM.

03-05-2006, 05:31 PM	#2 (permalink)
Final Chapta End of Story Join Date: May 2002 Location: DM, Steady Posts: 9,876	i agree. dude was sick with it today.. __________________ i 'd Lou piniella you hoes .. But im too Hot to Manage Was carvin up the Cool Table when you had Pogs n Slammers Quote , UnQuote

03-05-2006, 06:37 PM	#3 (permalink)
Cigma Maxwell's Demon Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: San Antonio, TX (Go Spurs!) Posts: 11,952	Tony Parker for most improved! Diaw is nice though, but you can attribute his success from a combination of more playing time and playing in a different system, instead of buried deep in the bench in a half court orientated offense. __________________ ···• MíÇ Infinite Alumni •··· ~)(~ RSTL RecorD 25 - 6 ~)(~ *Restless Nights Lead To Divine Insights Worlds Within The Flicker Of The Candlelight I Write.* Meek men make pussy powerful But words are things, and a small drop of ink,falling like dew,upon a thought, produces, that which **makes thousands, perhaps millions, think. - Lord Byron**

03-05-2006, 07:02 PM	#4 (permalink)
Brahman ® Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: 37th Chamber Posts: 17,022	how is tony parker deserving of most improved? his scoring has boosted a little with a better fg%, but his rebounds are the same and his ast/to ratio has worsened __________________ U Y d Z \ 卍卍卍卍卍卍卍亹见谷 ∞ 谷见亹

03-05-2006, 07:03 PM	#5 (permalink)
double ML is evolution. Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: at the crib laughin' my ass off at the lakers' chokejob Posts: 52,742	tony parker is french. he doesn't count. ignores the fact that diaw is also french __________________ dope quote of the moment: "Nigga you look like the gay hairdresser from Zohan, fuck up."- DRUG.(shittin' on pyro tecknik's existence) idiot quote of the moment: "at least 20/10 on a regular.. niggaz a beast"- jnyce(talkin' about kwame brown, and clearly showin' he doesn't know a goddamn thing about the NBA)

03-05-2006, 11:15 PM	#8 (permalink)
Brahman ® Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: 37th Chamber Posts: 17,022	tim duncan's still playing very good basketball, and i don't see how tony parker's intangible improvements have benefitted the spurs more than boris diaw's tangible improvements have benefitted both him and the suns... decision-making has to be backed by something numerical, and a worse AST/TO ratio is not exactly indicative of "better decision-making" the suns are missing amare stoudemire, and in comes this kid who's not used to being one of a team's important pieces and flourishes while keeping the team above pre-season expectations boris diaw > tony parker in terms of consideration for MIP easily __________________ U Y d Z \ 卍卍卍卍卍卍卍亹见谷 ∞ 谷见亹

03-05-2006, 11:46 PM	#9 (permalink)
Cigma Maxwell's Demon Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: San Antonio, TX (Go Spurs!) Posts: 11,952	But look - you keep pointing out things like 'a worse asst/to' ratio and that's suppose to mean that he hasn't got better? Watch the games, by your logic Parker has regressed. He's easily better than last year. Coincidence how the coaches selected him to be an All-Star? Also Tim Duncan is not right. He's not scoring, and that is tangibly affecting Parkers asst/to ratio. Ginobili has been injuried this year too. That tangibly affects Parkers asst/to ratio. You can't just look at the stat sheet and correlate it to something, they stats can be misleading. As far as Diaw is concerned, the change in scenery and increased playing time accounts for his increased stats, just as much as any 'improvement' in his game that has manifested. How about the tangibles of having Steve Nash, Marion and company, plus the Suns up and down system. On his former team, Diaw was mired on the bench and out of favor. They wanted him to be more of a scorer, and he is a very unselfish, pass first player. On the Suns his passing first mentality fits with what they do. I can't really say that Diaw improved that much - rather that he has freed to be the type of player he's more comfortable being. How can you guage his improvement, when he didn't get minutes last year? Anyway, the leap from not playing to being a good player in a role that's more suited for you - does not in my mind outweigh the leap from very good to elite. Not everyone can make that jump, into the top echelon. Parker has developed more of a mastery on his game, and Diaw is just now able to play his. __________________ ···• MíÇ Infinite Alumni •··· ~)(~ RSTL RecorD 25 - 6 ~)(~ *Restless Nights Lead To Divine Insights Worlds Within The Flicker Of The Candlelight I Write.* Meek men make pussy powerful But words are things, and a small drop of ink,falling like dew,upon a thought, produces, that which **makes thousands, perhaps millions, think. - Lord Byron** Last edited by Cigma; 03-05-2006 at 11:56 PM.

03-05-2006, 11:56 PM	#10 (permalink)
Brahman ® Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: 37th Chamber Posts: 17,022	yeah, i'm looking... for practical purposes, though, it makes no sense to scrutinize players' games that closely, because you'd be in an endless search of picking apart variables and will end up overlooking somebody. if we analyzed all players the way you're analyzing parker, i'm sure we'd come up with somebody who's improved more than he has. i don't think the league has ever given out the MIP award on the basis you're calling for in defense of tony parker... it almost always goes to the player who's seen the biggest tangible jumps in their outputs for whatever reason, be it more playing time, a new system, etc. boris diaw is not only getting better stats because of higher minutes... he's become a lot more efficient with his shooting and passing as well. __________________ U Y d Z \ 卍卍卍卍卍卍卍亹见谷 ∞ 谷见亹

03-06-2006, 12:00 AM	#11 (permalink)
Cigma Maxwell's Demon Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: San Antonio, TX (Go Spurs!) Posts: 11,952	Read my editted post. Tim Duncan is having an off year, Ginobili is having an off year. That affects Parker's asst/to ratio. Those two scorers are the normal beneficiaries of Parkers assits, and they aren't scoring. That's your only flaw with his game? Lol.. you point out Diaw has become more efficient with his shooting and passing.. but Parker is shooting the second best fg % in the league besides Shaq! Nash is having almost a better year than last year, Marion is having a better year than last year. Diaw was with the Hawks last year... hrm. Correlation? How can you say Diaw has become more efficient shooting and passing, when you didn't get to see him do that last year? There is no benchmark for Diaw. Parker we can see made the leap from great to elite. __________________ ···• MíÇ Infinite Alumni •··· ~)(~ RSTL RecorD 25 - 6 ~)(~ *Restless Nights Lead To Divine Insights Worlds Within The Flicker Of The Candlelight I Write.* Meek men make pussy powerful But words are things, and a small drop of ink,falling like dew,upon a thought, produces, that which **makes thousands, perhaps millions, think. - Lord Byron**

03-06-2006, 01:19 AM	#12 (permalink)
Old Soul Nipple Nibbler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: I'll stay below the surface, breaking bread with worms. It's depravity, not gravity, that anchors flesh to Earth......... Los Angeles, CA Posts: 26,809	They're not gonna give it to someone like Parker because he already put up good statlines. __________________ All I can say is that my life is pretty plain I like watchin' the puddles gather rain And all I can do is just pour some tea for two and speak my point of view, but it's not sane, It's not sane I just want some one to say to me I'll always be there when you wake Ya know I'd like to keep my cheeks dry today So stay with me and I'll have it made

03-06-2006, 01:47 AM	#13 (permalink)
Cigma Maxwell's Demon Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: San Antonio, TX (Go Spurs!) Posts: 11,952	When I said "Tony Parker for most improved!" - I was being facetious. His stats haven't increased dramatically, but his game, in terms of what he does on the court and the manner in which he performs, has defintley elevated to new heights. Diaw will more than likely receive the nod and he is very deserving. It was not my intent to downplay Diaw. __________________ ···• MíÇ Infinite Alumni •··· ~)(~ RSTL RecorD 25 - 6 ~)(~ *Restless Nights Lead To Divine Insights Worlds Within The Flicker Of The Candlelight I Write.* Meek men make pussy powerful But words are things, and a small drop of ink,falling like dew,upon a thought, produces, that which **makes thousands, perhaps millions, think. - Lord Byron**